Caller: And then there's the Lily Pond Road and then there's a six foot tall fence. So if you were to ask me has a mountain lion ever passed through New Hampshire and been spotted by somebody who wasnt able to get hard evidence? Id personally be willing to say "probably, yes.". Peter Biello: And then it ran away okay. Rick van de Poll: Oh yeah absolutely. The great thing about pictures isn't the animal itself it's the background. I mean that so many of them are false sightings we. Well they are the same. She was having a garden party on her back porch and everybody in the party saw this mountain lion across the field down below the porch. 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. Do you get a lot of these these these things that end up being hoaxes. We'd be inundated with scouts in the past when newspaper articles have been written about DNA and scouts. Give today. Peter Biello: This is the exchange on an HD PR fine Peter Biello and today we're talking with folks who can tell us about the mysterious elusive mountain line and whether or not it is actually here in New Hampshire. N.H. Peter Biello: From New Hampshire Public Radio I'm Peter Biello in for Lark Knoy and this is the exchange. Sam Evans-Brown: So Tim so this cat's been been referenced a couple of times I think we should talk about it specifically lay the whole story out for folks who haven't heard the story because it's actually I think really indicative of a lot of stuff for talking about. Well thanks for sharing. So I certainly can't dispute anything that they said there's no evidence for me to go by to verify or say what my thoughts are on the situation. As recently as 2011 there was one young male mountain lion that cruised all the way from the black hills of South Dakota, up over the Great Lakes, down through New Yorkgetting spotted all along the waykilled a beaver near the Quabbin Reservoir in Central Massachusetts, left behind prints and DNA at that site, and then was hit by a car in Connecticut. And just one more note about this danger question when even when you look at the states that have extended populations stable populations of mountain lions attacks are relatively rare. Peter Biello: Listeners give us a call if you have a question or a story of a sighting 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7. And you know it's rather interesting because certainly there are those you as a case of mistaken identity or they wanted to see something that perhaps they actually didn't. I'm Peter Biello. First off if the standard for an agency to go forward with the public and put out a press release that them outlines here their believers are going to say I told you they'd been here the whole time. As I tried to get a picture of it so there was it was definitely we looked up all the pictures and it was definitely not a bobcat or anything else being it looked just like a mountain lion. So so do what you can get to do what you can to get proof. Don't miss your chance to win three two thousand dollar gas gift cards at any station of your choice not to mention the grand prize twenty five thousand dollars toward a new car. Peter Biello: Nice to be here. Residents from Bedford to Berlin have been reporting sightings for years. All they think it traveled north through Canada up you know crossed across the Great Lakes and then and then down again through New York State. But my experience was that the majority of these accounts could not be taken lightly. I live pretty much on the town line of Greenfield just a couple of miles down in the Greenfield. Anytime at any HP broad dot org or subscribe to our podcast search Apple podcasts Google Play or stitcher for an HP bar exchange. We've met Fish and Game's BURDEN OF PROOF. Peter Biello: Wow. Over a period of a year and a half, this Mountain Lion left DNA evidence in at least four states. Mike thanks for your call. And really whenever you hear tiny code and long rope like tale it's kind of hard to pin this sighting on any other creature rather than an outline or just nothing else really matches that description. I think as Pat was saying you know 35 to 50 pounds on a male be reasonable range whereas mountain lions you're up to 100 110 maybe even 130 pounds on a big male. I tracked cats and all the western states. Thanks for your call. No I saw a camel. The best documentation we have in New Hampshire suggests there hasnt been a mountain lion killed by a hunter in this state since 1885. Peter Biello: Sam I wanted to ask you a little bit about that first and then turn to Patrick Tate efficient game. So it's there was no question in my mind. And I was probably about a half a mile from downtown all village on the right. The states never denied mountain lions are here, and theyve never admitted mountain lions are here. Well let me ask maybe Pat and Rick about this. So I will just say this is a big reason why there have not been confirmed sightings I think is that the evidence required first. So the U.S. Forest Service Rocky Mountain Research Station has a database on mountain lion and they can identify. If you go on YouTube and search mount lion Pat you can see people patent their hundred pound kiddie like its regular mascot cat. I saw the tail end of a literally from behind the shoulder The Long Tail mountain lion crossing the highway going from Password to often Village downtown. She is renowned for tracking. Sam Evans-Brown: Well first I want to sort of explain why what the theory is but then also throw a bit of cold water on it because I don't think there's much much logic behind it but essentially is that if fish and game were to acknowledge that there was a population of Mount lions in the state there's a chance that something like a listing under the federal Endangered Species Act might happen and then there'd be you know some they'd have to put a plan in place to protect the species there'd be you know restrictions put on development. Part II. The Eastern mountain lion is extinct in the eastern United States and Canada, but in 2011, a . OK. They create these scrapes where theyre communicating with each other with scent. Is there a way we can learn more about these dispersing mountain lions that may travel through the Granite State and that I would ask you certainly part about whether or not a he's spending too much time chasing down these kind of false leads or B would rather be doing something else that is more informative to whether or not we actually have or can prove that we have dispersing mountain lions in the state. I looked at the picture and asked me what do you see in the picture and I wrote back. But if people are still seeing mountain lions, why is the state and federal government seeking to COVER IT UP!? support for an HBO who comes from you our listener Sam from advanced in you a local New Hampshire nonprofit specializing in college student loans and student refinancing options. Pat humans people leave deer carcasses up in trees. Yes. NHPR is nonprofit and independent. They are the same thing. Mountain Lion | Squam Lakes Natural Science Center All exhibit and hiking trails are CLOSED for the season. So for our scientists to do the lumping and whatnot. So I've been convinced the whole time that I saw a big cougar plume or whatever you want to call it standing there in the road in Greenfield. Peter Biello: Yeah some of what she was saying sounds like it would require getting pretty close or at least having a nice zoom lens right Sam like. Not one picture of him online while the person meet with us. Well Is DNA the most reliable means we have of identifying whether or not what we saw is actually a mountain lion. Or years or so. Listeners give us a call if you'd like. And I I have this great text history of New Hampshire game and fir bears and I think by Helen Silver who used to work for fish and game and she sort of I kind eyes this animal in one of the quotes from 1892 stating that the catamaran was the most ferocious of all the wild beasts of New Hampshire his great size strength and agility of movement together with his formidable weapons rendered him the terror both of man and beast. If youd like to submit a question (or send a mountain line photo) you can record it as a voice memo on your smart phone and send it tooustidein@nhpr.org, OR call our hotline, 1-844-GO-OTTER (1-844-466-8837) and leave a message. Less than a year later I found a scat on the swamp range and I was working at the time with a fellow at the Michigan wildlife habitat Federation. Monday, December 5th: Mountain Lions in New Hampshire? And today we're talking about the mysterious elusive mountain line with folks who know something about it. WMUR uLocal: On this trail cam video, an unidentified feline is spotted. Thank you. No evidence and other states where Mountain lights have turned up. Join as a $8 per month sustainer and get our brand-new owl umbrella! Today on the exchange we discuss what residents may have been seeing and what breeding mountain lion pairs would mean for our ecosystem. It's you know I recognized their report and. Caller: And the more I thought about it the color of it it was definitely not a bobcat. Is there something particularly hospitable about New Hampshire Forests that make them want to come here. Part II. The species that once inhabited the Northeast, known as the eastern mountain lion, is now extinct. Sunny today high temperatures low to mid 80s it'll be clear tonight overnight lows in the 50s for tomorrow sunshine with high temperatures mid to upper 80s. Peter Biello: Worth mentioning if we're scaring anybody question a mysterious mountain lions lurking perhaps in someone's backyard. Any sense of of whether or not mountain lions are sort of wary of more population dense areas like like the one he was describing Rick. Peter Biello: Well hey Rob. There is some information that suggests that it spent a portion of its time in Massachusetts near the Claiborne reservoir. Updated: 9:53 AM EST Dec 6, 2016. Reviewing the evidence, the U.S. Course like Sue said you have to see it and it's not always that visible. HOLDERNESS, N.H. (AP) Two of the known mountain lions in New Hampshire have spent their 15 years in close proximity to humans. Peter Biello: And Carl before you continue I think Patrick Tate just give me a second. I can't. Caller: Well I think Patrick I recognized your name. He writes As a farmer I come across many outdoorsman looking to hunt our property had a conversation with one who believed very strongly that we had mountain lions in New Hampshire. And what was really remarkable about the whole thing was I was maybe a half mile down on all buildings. Patrick Tate: I would say well when social media first started they picked up the hoaxes became much more prevalent in the last four or five years hoaxes have died down completely. We're gonna talk about sightings in this part of the program as well we'd love to hear your story. Now again I don't know that there's anything to that. Thanks for a great thanks. So here we have you know a very qualified biologist who who found a print took a plaster cast found a scat send it to a university. We're gonna cue you up and bring into the program listeners in just a moment but I want to ask about the role that Mountain Lions play in the ecosystem we've been talking a lot about mountain lions traveling and being sort of hard to track as they move. Caller: Oh hi. Peter Biello: Or send us an email exchange at an HP board. On a dirt road. Patrick Tate: No downward pressure at all I think actually Sean turned up and we found the evidence there a number of people would finally say finally we can put this debate to bed. Me Im willing to believe its possible that there are some out there. Sam. It all used to be based on measurable physical traits color, skull size, paw size, etc but now its based on whether an animal can be shown to be genetically distinct from others. BRADFORD, N.H. - All that snow in parts of the Northeast has more than just kids jumping for winter joy. Are these big cats back?Subscribe to WMUR on YouTube now for more: http://bit.ly/1lOjX9CGet more Manchester news: http://wmur.comLike us: http://facebook.com. Rick van de Poll: Well education is the real important thrust of of what all of us do as biologists and Game Managers and to make sure that a things like what Sam was saying that in spite of what you believe the mountain lions will not eat your children they will not steal your pets from your backyard and they will not necessarily be seen by you unless you're extremely lucky. He says when youve got a mountain lion in town, its kinda obvious. Peter Biello: Well Mike thanks very much for sharing your story. So let's let's go to the phones. Which brings us to the next question, what are the odds that some of these reported sightings (which, when I posted about this on twitter, I immediately started to get as well) are actually people seeing a mountain lion? And still the the folks there did weren't able to come up with it with 100 percent certainty what deposited that scat. So and so they so they do get pretty involved. I mean there was this one lady I remember and tough tomorrow. Gotcha, so the Deep State is suppressing mountain lion news in order to prop up New Hampshire tourism? Sue Morse: The big cat really commands the utmost respect not so much fear but fascination. Thank you for visiting the New Hampshire Fish and Game Department website. Patrick Tate: So the individuals can say that but for an agency that's based on science and what not to to go off with no evidence and then get into that giant debate and all these other issues and put credibility at risk I don't think that would be a great path to take. So nowadays we think of this in the Northeast as crazy stuff that people have a mountain lion as a pet. Sam Evans-Brown: You know the North America had a number of large predator species when humans first arrived in the continent. The number 1 800 8 9 2 6 4 7 7 so promised a discussion about conspiracy theories. I saw that had this giant the bobcat had this giant sweeping which is John Bobcat don't have big sweeping tails. So you want identifiable backgrounds. I actually been interviewed a couple of times by reporters and with all due respect for the media you know facts aren't always communicated correctly. NH Fish and Game relies on physical evidence to answer questions about the presence or absence of mountain lion in the state. 50 feet above the most. So maybe a good pet for you but not for your neighbor if you just stop by unannounced. Long before NASA was asked to put a man on the moon one engineer had already figured out how to get there. Patrick Tate: So it's very typical. Caller: Yeah I hadn't experienced blastoff fall so this was around September and I was driving from Webster into Concord on Horse Hill Road and anybody in the area would know I was right near the Red Barn and all of a sudden this animal jumps out of the woods and it bounded across the road in about two two giant leaps and stopped in the field just on the other side. Are there Mountain Lions in NH? Thanks for calling. I've collected scat samples I've got several in my collection. There have been several sightings of mountain lions in New Hampshire recently. I had a resident in New Hampshire tell me a story of a mountain lion in the 1960s where a person who would come summer in New Hampshire and then live in a different part of the country in the winter had a trailer that was housing his mount line. But you've done some reporting on this. So I reached down to grab the camera and looked back and like a ghost it's gone. But you won't find evidence of their existence in paw prints in the snow or a deer carcass in a tree. He played a pivotal role and he battled for recognition. And Rick van de Poll naturalist and founder of ecosystem management consultants of New England. Which which I think Pat and I have both experienced. Peter Biello: We got an e-mail question from Robert in Epsom who asks are sightings or encounters with these big cats less dangerous here where they're passing through than out west where those same mountain lines might be establishing territory Rick. All of that remains unanswered but it is an extremely interesting question. Support for an age PR comes from you our listeners. Someone's got to see one they're very secretive. Give today. Using DNA and physical evidence, state environmental officials said they determined that the animal. Its impossible to say, but I think the odds are pretty good that some of these sightings are legit. Peter Biello: So if they were female mountain lions here they would be more males just because that's what they're looking for. Patrick Tate: It became a very interesting investigation over time because it started becoming. What kind of animal is that. I was a Bobcat we saw it and I have a picture of it. People were calling the New Hampshire Fish and Game director's office saying why are you dragging your feet on this. And I think a lot of folks would like them to be around. Do you want to see real, living mountain lions that do exist in New Hampshire. 1957. So for those reasons I don't believe the standards are too high the amount of game cameras out on the landscape to record images department alone through contracts had over 150 throughout the state biologists go through various deer yards throughout the year. Thank you. A monthly donation of $5 makes a real difference. So what those ranges. Absolutely. Mountain lions don't usually travel more than 100 miles from where they are born. So so in 2011 a mountain lion was killed in a car accident in Connecticut a car hit a mountain lion and killed it. Thank you very much for listening. And in fact in 2011 when it was announced that the eastern cougar was officially extinct the reason that announcement was made is because they said really that it never existed. Yes. The tail leave is a giveaway but not everybody gets to see the tail. Let us know your story and share your photos! They're just moving around freely. Peter Biello: Hmm. The big cat has been extinct here since the mid-1800s. Mike Guyton pressure was almost Greyhound like very muscular large back legs on it and the coloration on it was almost an orange brownish orange color and so I stop and I look at this thing in the field and as the animal looks at me the face was very chiseled definitely not a bobcat.
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